Is It Ok To Half-Ass a Workout?

(That's not how we actually feel by the way!)

This is another solo/ duo episode where we shoot the sh*t and talk about all things body image, diet culture and embracing our 'here and now' bodies.

Christine's husband asked her to join him on his 'HELL' run this Saturday and it got us thinking about how so many of us see exercise as a form of punishment or self-flagellation.  A penance for eating the doughnut or having the cake when we 'should have had more willpower' or just been 'good'.

If movement had ZERO impact on your body in terms of aesthetics, would you choose to move in the same way?

A question we ask ourselves frequently.  In this episode we discuss whether you should always give it 100% or whether showing up is enough.

Untangling movement and weight loss is TOUGH but entirely possible.  Let us know if you agree or reach out if you have any comments or questions after today's show.

Please reach out if you would like some support with your relationship to food OR movement. Ela currently has limited spaces for Intuitive Eating coaching and if you'd like to reconnect with movement, contact Christine.

AND if you enjoyed this episode, please share and follow the 'Find Your Strong podcast' and if you have time, write us a short review. It would honestly mean the world. Love to you all, Ela & Christine x

Transcript

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Christine Chessman: Hello! Hello! How are you? We are here for another episode. I was gonna say solo, but it's not solo, because we're both here.

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Ela Law: Duo, aren't we.

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Christine Chessman: But we've got a topic we were thinking about what to talk about today. I've got so much to talk about. I could just, I mean, it's going to be infinity number of podcasts. But I've been really thinking about movement and food in terms of being hard. So doing things that are hard, otherwise there's no point. And this was prompted by my lovely husband, suggesting, We go for a run on Saturday.

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Christine Chessman: and I said, Oh, where should we go? And he said, I'm looking for a new run that's going to be hell. And on his last run he almost cried about 5 times, because it was so hard.

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Christine Chessman: M.

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Ela Law: Wow!

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Christine Chessman: I've kind of got to the point where I'm like, I don't mind challenging myself. I really like a challenge in a workout, but I also want on a weekend to do a nice plod I want to run. I want to kind of take breaks. I want to go for a coffee. I don't want to be doing 8 miles uphill.

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Christine Chessman: crying.

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Ela Law: Why ever not Christine?

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Christine Chessman: Know, but it's it's, you know. I think we're really conditioned in this culture

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Christine Chessman: to think that unless it's awful there's no point unless we are struggling unless we are starving ourselves in terms of food.

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unknown: Or eating stuff that we don't really like, because it's n inverted commas healthy. Then there's no point.

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unknown: Hmm.

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unknown: I think that's a real thing. And you know one of my one of my many of my clients actually say, if I give them an exercise, and they start doing it.

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unknown: The amount of times that I've heard. Where is this supposed to hurt?

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unknown: Not supposed to hurt, you know, and if they don't feel this is awful, they don't feel like it's working.

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unknown: Wow!

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unknown: I've never really thought about it in those terms. I often ask, whenever I get instructions, I always ask, Where am I supposed to feel this. And then I describe the muscle that I'm feeling that's working and checking, whether I'm doing it right. But I've never even see this is this. This shows you how I exercise, because as soon as it becomes punishing I'm out. I'm like, no, no, I can't be doing with it. It's too hard. I told you the story once that I limped, fake, limped out of a spin class. Did I.

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unknown: Yeah, you did. But that's awful.

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unknown: Yeah, yeah, because it was just so hard. And I needed an excuse to get out. I don't do that hard. I'm very happy to go like the highest level, but as soon as it becomes too hard I'm like, bye see ya

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unknown: so I find that very curious that people ask you, where is it supposed to hurt? That wouldn't have crossed my mind.

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unknown: Yeah, that's cool.

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unknown: Wow!

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unknown: I'm like. I mean, it's it's I find it now, because I think I've deconditioned myself. If that's the word I'm just doing this boxing now, which is brilliant.

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unknown: But on Tuesday I went, and she works me hard, I mean, really.

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unknown: But I got she's working me so hard that I'm sweating like a lot profusely. I haven't sweated like that for years to the point that it makes me a bit. I'm like, oh, this is quite weird, you know, because I think I've not maybe worked that hard for years since I got into this whole sort of different way of thinking around it. I've gone for long runs. I've I've done boot camps. I've done all of the stuff, but it's

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unknown: I don't push it anymore, because I don't to the same degree.

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unknown: Because it's not for me. That's not what counts. That's not what makes a good workout.

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unknown: But do you still enjoy the boxing? What? What sort of keeps you at it? And how how does that feel in comparison to all of the other workouts that you do.

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unknown: I love this. This is my. We're talking about geology. I love the fact that I find it really hard

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unknown: and.

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unknown: Okay.

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unknown: It's for me it's good cognitively, because it is all she's very good, you know. You got a job cross kick with left with right. You've got to change your footing. You've got to. It's very much you've got to be

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unknown: on it on the ball mentally, and it's good to get some anger out which.

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unknown: I have.

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unknown: Lot of it seems.

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unknown: and you know I love it because I see improvements as well. And that's important.

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unknown: Hmm.

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unknown: In terms of that keeping, going to something it's like for me.

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unknown: Maybe that's Adhd, Brian. How but for you, in terms of your boot camp.

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unknown: What keeps you going to Boot camp? Is it the camaraderie? Is it the people?

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unknown: Is it.

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unknown: Yeah, I mean, the people.

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unknown: Eyes.

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unknown: People are great. There's a lot of swearing which is always fun. I love it because it's outside. I'm not someone who likes to exercise indoors, really. So that really it got me on a rainy day. I thought, Okay, I've got to do something like that because I love that idea. It is hard, but it is.

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unknown: Yeah. I like what you said about the duality, so something can be hard and still be enjoyable.

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unknown: Yes.

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unknown: Whereas when you said about your husband, I need to find a sort of a hellish run.

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unknown: I'm trying to find the enjoyment in that, because obviously he's allowed to like it because it is really hard and challenging. But is there something else as well for him? Is it the challenge? Is it that? Oh, afterwards like, look what I've done! Look what I've achieved! Is it the achievement about it, or what? What is it? Because when people say, oh, where's it supposed to hurt?

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unknown: Maybe they have something else that a secondary gain there as well? It's not just about the hurting. Maybe they are allowed to enjoy it, even though it's hurting. Does that make sense.

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unknown: I do. Yep, that that is, I think that's the the line that's blurred, though, isn't it?

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unknown: Because when people think about exercise a lot of people, I just use the term people like you can't. You can't so generalize like that. But you do think oh, it's a chore. It should be hard it should.

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unknown: you know. I lots of people don't like exercise, because what they think it means, or what they think it looks like.

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unknown: yeah, for for for Ed, he his rationale was.

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unknown: He's not going to be able to push it like this forever. So he wants to see. Maybe he wants to see what his body can do. Yeah, I get that.

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unknown: Yeah, I get that.

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unknown: Yep.

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unknown: So.

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unknown: But do we.

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unknown: While you can.

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unknown: Do it while you can, and I do. There's a part of me that can totally.

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unknown: I can understand that that resonates with me.

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unknown: But I no longer want to push it the way I used to, so I have limits. My my bar is lower now.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: So I don't. I don't need to run a 5 k. In 21 min.

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unknown: I don't need to. I would much prefer to run it with somebody and have a chat and get a coffee.

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unknown: Yeah, yeah, so it sounds, there's a lot about proving to yourself, or maybe to others, and some for some people that you can.

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unknown: but also that you've come to a place where you don't have to prove anything to anybody anymore. And you're just doing it because you enjoy it rather than because you want to say, Oh, check me out. I've done X number of drop kicks and sweat it so much and worked really hard. It's not something

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unknown: that you need to get.

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unknown: Prove to yourself. It's a book it's about. It is hard. Yes, but I don't have to prove to myself that I can do it. Is that right?

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unknown: And there's something about, you know. People sort of see me as a runner.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: And I, you know I used to do all the races and be fairly

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unknown: speedy, I guess, for me. So people always go. Oh, what's your time? What was your time? What was your time? What was? And I think I just got fed up with that. I got fed up of Strava and the apps and people going. Oh, well done! It was fast. That was a fast split, or you did. I don't want to be judged on that anymore.

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unknown: Right.

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unknown: There's nothing wrong with enjoying and embracing those things. Nothing wrong at all. But I find I couldn't separate that from my history of eating disorders, and.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: How I used to punish myself with exercise, so it seems very tied in with that. So the boxing nobody gives a crap about the boxing in terms of they have no point of reference.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: And I'm not doing it to to win a fight.

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unknown: I'm not enter any fight. I'm just doing it because I enjoy it, and I enjoy

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unknown: getting a bit more flexible and and feeling a bit stronger. So it's a nice

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unknown: there's no specific goal that I'm heading towards.

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unknown: Hmm.

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unknown: I just enjoy working hard and feeling better.

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unknown: Yeah, yeah.

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unknown: What about you when you finish Boot camp? There must be. Now you go to a boot camp. There must be some sessions that you really work hard.

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unknown: Yeah, yeah.

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unknown: excuse me. I would say

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unknown: generally. And this is, this is a general attitude for me personally, but I'm not saying it's better or worse than another attitude. If I show up.

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unknown: I show up.

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unknown: If I feel like

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unknown: I'm only gonna give 50% today because I'm not feeling it. Then, I'm thinking, well, maybe I should rest today. Maybe today is not the day for me to do that kind of exercise. Maybe I should do something else.

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unknown: Generally when I go I I work hard because I feel like

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unknown: I'm here. I can, so I will.

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unknown: If when I'm there.

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unknown: things are too hard. I stop, or I reduce, or I amend I do something different. And our trainers just. She's brilliant. She's like you do what works for you.

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unknown: She's encouraging, but she would never sort of insist on. Well, you do that exercise, for example. I will not do a Burpee. I do not do burpees full stop. I'm having that on my tombstone. She never did a burpee, because I hate the bloody fuckers, and also they make me dizzy, and that they're bloody hard, and I just don't like them, and my back doesn't like them, so I will not do that. So I'll do something else instead. Maybe something that isn't as hard.

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unknown: Maybe something that isn't as punishing for me personally. Other people love them, but I just really don't. So I tend to. When I show up. I tend to show up. If that makes sense.

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unknown: -

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unknown: And that's not just when I exercise that is, if I,

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unknown: if I do a podcast recording with you, I do a podcast. Recording with you. I'm not half hour sitting on my sofa listening to you say something. I'm engaged, and I think that's a general thing, that if I if I make the effort to do something and show up. Then I'm going to be there.

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unknown: I'm not half arsing.

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unknown: This is interesting. So I love burpees.

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unknown: I thought you might.

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unknown: I do. I really do. I quite like them, but I like to press up, and I like all that.

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unknown: Oh, yeah, see, I don't like those either.

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unknown: I love it, love it. But yes, I have the opposite view. So then Matthew Mcconaughey wrote, had this like motivational speech, I don't know what I'm talking about. Matthew Mcconaughty.

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unknown: He's nice.

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unknown: I mean. Yeah, I think he's all right.

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unknown: said you don't do anything. You don't. He doesn't half ass anything in his life.

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unknown: Right.

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unknown: You're going to do it. You give it a hundred percent, you know it's all, and I disagree.

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unknown: I disagree. So my whole rhetoric, in fact.

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unknown: to my clients who are doing strength training with me. It's still up.

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unknown: Show up!

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unknown: On the days that you don't have energy. Give it only as much as you can.

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unknown: -

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unknown: On the days that you have more energy, give it more.

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unknown: Otherwise, I mean for me, I would probably rarely do anything if I just went on how

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unknown: I was feeling in terms of yeah, no,

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unknown: not really up for it today.

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unknown: Hmm.

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unknown: Very different if you're ill.

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unknown: If you haven't slept, or you know you've got to make sure your your bases are covered.

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unknown: -

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unknown: But generally, you know, I'm not going to feel like it, probably 50% of the time, to be frank, but I show up, and I give it what I can. Those days.

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unknown: Just so that I've got that.

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unknown: So that because strength training for me is my base of doing anything else. And it's also so that I can be independent longevity. All of that kind of stuff

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unknown: i'm talking about 2 times 25 min a week, I'm not talking about hours and hours in the gym.

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unknown: so I will show up to that.

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unknown: Unless I'm ill. Last week I was ill. So I didn't, but

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unknown: I always encourage people, especially during the times of Covid, when people needed that social connection, even online, to keep showing up, you know, have joined that community. Keep being part of it. Do what you can because you don't. Progress takes all different kinds of ways. But if you only show up when you feel like, yeah, I would hardly ever be there.

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unknown: Oh, yeah, I I.

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unknown: I jumped.

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unknown: In there. Yeah, I I don't only show up when I feel like that, because I don't feel like that all the time. What I mean.

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unknown: yeah, is that if I make the decision to show up.

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unknown: I'm going to try my hardest to actually do something with that time that I have allocated to that.

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unknown: whatever it is that I'm showing up to. Does that make sense? So I completely hear you, and I think, do what you can, and showing up is absolutely

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unknown: is absolutely key. But also, I think sometimes when we made the decision to show up.

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unknown: you know, we we can maybe use that momentum to actually do something with that time. We are allocating that time. We're spending that time on something showing up is fantastic. That's the 1st step, for sure.

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unknown: but use that time and and make it work for you in some way. And yeah, I totally get that. If you don't feel 100%. And you don't want to give 100%, then don't give 100%. But you're working within your bandwidth, and you're working up to that bandwidth, and I think that's why I was trying to say that I will do that. But if it gets too far I'm not going to push myself and punish myself.

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unknown: Yeah, so that's yeah.

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unknown: So it's kind of like a bit of what you said, and a bit of what I think I might have.

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unknown: Yeah, I agree. I agree, I had a client today just as an example. And I mean, it's obviously if you're privileged enough to be able to afford a personal trainer. That's great, and you can do this with a personal trainer. But she was not feeling amazing, but still wanted to do something, she said. I almost canceled, and I thought right. I don't think I should be doing heavyweights with this client. I think she just about showed up.

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unknown: So let's focus on something really slow and something that she quite likes.

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unknown: And so we did balance, and we took it down a notch. We did body weight, only we made it fun.

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unknown: And then we got close to the ground. So it was a bit easier.

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unknown: You know, we feel supported all of that kind of stuff, because on those days there is no point in putting a really heavy Kettlebell in somebody's hand and asking them to do muscle ups for, you know, 20 min. It's just not going to serve anybody.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: But I like the fact that she showed up and did something. She's moved her body, and we've had a nice chat, and it's

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unknown: she's keeping that sort of promise to herself.

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unknown: Like. I'm going to do this twice a week, you know, and and.

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unknown: Probably made her feel better because she did watch what was within her bandwidth. She showed up. She did.

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unknown: Yes.

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unknown: Was kind of achievable for her and manageable for her.

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unknown: And you very aptly sort of worked out well, today we're going to sort of

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unknown: tweak it and do something slightly different, and something that is

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unknown: sort of according to what what you can do today. And I think that's exact. That's that's what I mean. She showed up. That's the massive step right? She showed up.

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unknown: showing up and just sitting there is pointless. You might as well not bother, but doing something that works within your

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unknown: remit and your bandwidth. I keep using that word. Sorry, but you know what I mean. Once you showed up, you might.

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unknown: Today maybe.

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unknown: Your capacity. Once you showed up, you might as well do something with that.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: Yeah, if I if I felt really bad I wouldn't show up. I would just rest.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: I would make that decision. I made the decision to show up. Therefore let's see what I can do

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unknown: with that.

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unknown: 100%.

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unknown: Time. Do you see what I mean?

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unknown: Yeah, I do see what you mean, and I think it. Maybe it only becomes problematic if you are ill and you are still trying to keep going and keep doing the workouts and keep.

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unknown: Yes.

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unknown: Or you've had no sleep, but you still get up and force yourself to kind of when you've got nothing in the tank. I think there are. You've got to check in with yourself.

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unknown: You know, so I think absolutely show up if you don't feel like it, show up and do what you can. But if you're not. Well.

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unknown: no, no, stay in bed, take care of yourself, rest, drink fluids, do nothing, you know, or lie on the floor and meditate, or whatever is going to make you feel a little bit better. But

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unknown: I yeah, if a client says to me, I'm I've got a temperature. I've had some paracetamol. I'm gonna come, anyway, I'm gonna be like, no, you're not.

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unknown: Don't do it.

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unknown: Gonna stay home in bed.

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unknown: Yeah, absolutely.

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unknown: So I think that's when it becomes problematic, and we'll talk about the food side of it as well.

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unknown: Hmm.

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unknown: Because I do notice a pattern with so many people that I work with, or have worked with historically that they will push themselves to a point that they are burnt out, and then they get ill, because exercise is a stressor on the body.

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unknown: Hmm.

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unknown: But as soon as they get well again they go back into that cycle, because that's how they associate movement, exercise.

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unknown: Hmm.

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unknown: So it is. How do we break out of that, Ella? What is?

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unknown: You know? It's a hard one, isn't it? When you've I mean look at PE in school. Goodness! Most of us have been turned off movement through PE.

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unknown: Yeah, yeah, that's not.

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unknown: We've had bad experiences in PE, or we've had experiences where we've not felt athletic. We've not felt sporty. We've been made saying maybe our body didn't quite fit the mould

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unknown: more or PE.

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unknown: I'm doing all in for

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unknown: and maybe that's impacted. How we view exercise going forward I don't know.

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unknown: Yeah, it's probably got a big big role to play, doesn't it? Yeah, I mean, I.

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unknown: Know how.

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unknown: To how to. I haven't got the recipe to how to break out from from that kind of mindset, but I think it's

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unknown: it's about learning that exercise is not.

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unknown: It's not a very efficient, and shouldn't really be a tool for controlling your body.

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unknown: Date, like.

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unknown: In this in a sort of weight, related way, and finding

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unknown: finding a way of moving that is enjoyable and not punishing.

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unknown: It can be hard, but if it's a punishment, then there's there's something going on underneath that you might want to address because you you need to ask yourself, why do I want to punish myself? What is my gain from doing that?

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unknown: Yeah. And if you take just sort of underlying it.

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unknown: Yeah, if you take aesthetics out of the question, then what? How would you move? I always ask that question.

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unknown: Hmm.

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unknown: If movement did nothing 0 for your body in any way in terms of the aesthetics, would you still move as you're moving.

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unknown: Yeah, and what do people think

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unknown: when you ask that I'm interested.

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unknown: Mostly. No, they wouldn't. Some people. Yes, they would.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: Because that for their mental health that's so beneficial.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: So. But a lot of people are doing exercise that they believe is

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unknown: good for them in terms of physique.

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unknown: And weight loss which we've just debugged. I mean, it's really exercise. You cannot guarantee weight loss through exercise, and our bodies are changing and fluctuating throughout life, and how we exercise changes, how our bodies respond to exercise changes. It's not something that you can rely on. And if any man is on your screen, saying

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unknown: I need 10 Menopausal women from Brighton and hove for no, say, no. Have you put on wit? No.

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unknown: So if there's anybody trying to sell you weight loss through an exercise program. Walk away. Sorry.

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unknown: Happen, no.

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unknown: Just have to get that on.

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unknown: But can we talk about it from so in terms of movement and trying to sort of reframe how we feel about movement. I would just ask yourself that question. That's what I would say to all clients. 1st of all, would you move in the same way, if it wasn't about your body.

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unknown: Second of all, what?

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unknown: How do you want to feel when you move? Do you want to feel more flexible? Do you want to feel stronger. Do you want to feel just a bit more energy? Those kind of questions are really good questions other than, How do you want to look because of the way you move. That's not something that is actually

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unknown: possible to control.

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unknown: Yeah. And you can take exactly the same questions and transfer them to food. Because you can. You can ask those questions. How do you want to feel, would you? Would you eat what you like if it didn't have any effect on your body, shape or size?

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unknown: How would you like to feel when you eat right all of those questions that you just asked you can actually use when it comes to food as well. And then, you know if you ask a person, would you eat what you like? If it didn't have any effect on your body? They would say, of course I'd eat whatever I like.

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unknown: because there is, there's enjoyment in food that's often suppressed, because we think we shouldn't be eating certain things. But if we have, you know, free reign, we would eat what we what we like, and we would probably be more likely to eat as and when and how much we need at the same time, just like with movement. We would probably, if we tune into, you know, how would we like to feel? We would probably move in a way that makes us feel energized, stronger, more flexible.

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unknown: Yeah, because we.

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unknown: Feel it, and it's the same with food. If we feel how the food makes us feel, then

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unknown: it's more likely that we will eat according to that rather than to some external message. So yeah, I love those questions, and I think they translate beautifully to

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unknown: food as well.

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unknown: And you know, we we talked to Bree Campos, and I find it a really interesting, quite tricky conversation about rest, and you know her impression around creating that reframing, how she felt about movement and food actually, but she felt she had to give herself unconditional permission to rest similarly to food. The 1st principle of intuitive eating is giving yourself unconditional permission to eat.

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unknown: No and that's really hard, isn't it?

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unknown: Hmm!

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unknown: Yeah, let's.

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unknown: Thank you. Guys.

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unknown: Stuck on that, because there's this fear that if we do that we will not stop.

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unknown: So if you give yourself unconditional permission to rest. There's this fear inside of. Do you know what a lot of people that I've worked with, and a lot of people I speak to? There's this real fear of being

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unknown: perceived as lazy, and I think that is something to do with society, and I wonder whether part of people wanting to punish themselves with exercise is to kind of prove to themselves. Look, I'm not lazy. Look at this. Look, look at what I can do. I'm working really hard, and I'm wondering whether that is a fear that sort of been

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unknown: basically put into our brains from when we were little. You have to work hard. You have to achieve. You have to do all of those things, and if you don't.

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unknown: You are the sum of your achievements. Yeah.

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unknown: Yeah, exactly.

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unknown: Who are you? If you don't work your ass off and you don't. High achiever. Who are you?

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unknown: Exactly. I.

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unknown: And that's I think that's definitely something that I'm exploring, because I'm feeling very tired and burnt out at the minute. And I'm thinking maybe maybe I could be a person that doesn't

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unknown: pushed yourself constantly and actually works in a way that feels good. But that's

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unknown: it's a conversation for a different time. And it's also there's a lot of privilege attached to that, you know, if you can actually afford to take time out and think about how you're gonna work. That's definitely something which we can talk about. But yeah, I find that rest as well is something that, as Bree said, there's different types of rest, and that's something that I've made peace with. I struggle to rest so for me. Sitting sofa

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unknown: would not be restful for me, because my brain is so busy.

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unknown: all it would be doing is like, I better do that. It just would not be good for me. I'd rather do something like gentle movement, or go to the cinema, or meet a friend or me just resting, my mind goes beep, I, you know, overthink, overthink, overthink, overthink. It's just too busy right.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: So

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unknown: I need to find. And I'm sure that's the same for a lot of people. If you're neurodiverse in any way, it can be that it can be just that you need a different type of rest that doesn't look like somebody else's rest.

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unknown: Exactly. I was just going to say, rest is very vague, isn't it? When we, when we think of rest, we think of going to bed, or sitting on the sofa, but for some.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: Rest is a walk.

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unknown: just clearing their heads, or actually spending 15 min eating their food rather than wolfing it down at the computer. Rest can look so differently. And so for so many different people. And I'm a bit like you. I don't particularly enjoy

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unknown: resting, but I say for me it's a little bit of a

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unknown: I don't like resting in front of other people. So that's my own shit going on because I.

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unknown: Oh!

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unknown: Need to be seen as productive or doing stuff.

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unknown: So this is the thing right? This is what I mean about this kind of perception of, or being worried about being perceived as lazy or not doing enough.

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unknown: and.

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unknown: What would it mean if somebody thought you weren't doing enough? What what is.

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unknown: Well, it wouldn't. It wouldn't mean nothing, because it's none of their business whether I'm doing enough or not. But there's this.

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unknown: So is it? But but then, who's judging you? You're judging you.

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unknown: Oh, yeah, yeah, exactly that. So there's a lot of I'm working through that. And I've kind of made peace with that to a certain degree. But if you ask me the question.

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unknown: could you just sit on the sofa for an afternoon and do nothing and just rest?

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unknown: The answer is probably probably no, because I would find that incredibly boring, but also part of the answer is, well, if I'm just on my own, it's more likely that I could than if someone else is around and seeing me do that, does that make sense? So that is something that I'm working through as a sort of.

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unknown: We make that as part of our identity. And I see that with a lot of clients, I mean, probably 95% of my clients have that

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unknown: fear of being perceived as not working hard enough, not being productive enough, and

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unknown: it's really hard to allow yourself.

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unknown: Give you permission to rest.

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unknown: and I know that for myself it's hard, but I've got so much better at it, and I give myself those moments, and I sit with the discomfort of those moments

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unknown: challenge that. But it's something that you have to actively do, when, if that is your mindset, whereas it sounds like you sort of from a your brain is so busy that it feels really not restful to sit and rest for you.

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unknown: Yeah, I mean, I can watch TV, because that's I'm focusing on something. Yeah, I love films. So my, I think my favorite thing is, is going to cinema because I cannot do anything but sit in a chair and watch the movie. Yeah, I cannot go do the housework and go help the kids go, do some work or go. I can just sit there for 3 h and watch a film. So that is my happy place, you know absolutely my happy place. Yeah,

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unknown: so it's weird like that. I love TV. But generally no, the minute I watch TV while I'm doing the dishes, yeah.

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unknown: We have.

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unknown: While I'm hanging washing up, you know. I'm not actually just watching TV. I don't remember the last time unless I'm with the family, and I feel like it's a lovely bonding thing. The only time that I'll sit and watch TV and not do anything else.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: It's an interesting one. Sorry. I don't know how we've got onto TV. And

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unknown: but yeah, I was going to talk about fine. I know we're going to wrap it up. I was going to talk about eating in terms in some way to the movement as we just started to. There's a piece at the end of intuitive eating. So if you haven't read the intuitive eating book, I highly highly recommend it. We're both intuitive eating counselors, and it is phenomenal.

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unknown: It's gentle nutrition, and Evelyn and Elise, who are the co-creators of intuitive eating. They both sort of say you can do the principles in any order, but it is good to come to gentle nutrition after you've done the work.

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unknown: and I feel the same about movement, so I feel that you can build a gentle structure around your week in terms of strength, training, and blah blah. But I think you need to do the work 1st on reframing movement, and that might mean you need to take a step back from.

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unknown: Some of the activities that you're doing which are not enjoyable, which you dread, which you dread every week. So if you dread them occasionally, and then you have a great time brilliant, but if you're just oh, I don't want to do this constantly.

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unknown: Or if it is punishing, maybe take a step back and think about, what do I actually want to do? Is there a form of movement I might like to try. That might be fun, or that might be so. I think there is a place for that gentle structure.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: Similarly to that gentle nutrition with food.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: But you have to maybe do the work first.st

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unknown: Is that fine? Do you agree.

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unknown: Yeah, yeah, I think they're so interrelated, aren't they movement and our relationship with food? I think that's a really interesting point there, because I think. Yes, gentle nutrition kind of needs to come

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unknown: towards the end. Not necessarily like. Now we can do it. We've done all of the other things, because all of the other things are not ticked off the list. They are processes that you probably have to do, and employee life lifelong. But yeah, you're right. I think there's there needs to be a little bit of work done before you can. You can use that gentle nutrition part without making it into a set of rules or a diet, and I want

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unknown: what I meant.

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unknown: whether that is with movement, whether that is the same thing. You're exploring patterns, and you're looking at what patterns are no longer working for me, what patterns are actually harmful to me, what things might be might be serving me better. So you need to do that work first, st trying lots of different things out, maybe trying different exercises, seeing what what works for you.

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unknown: Before you know, before you can. You can come to that sort of okay. Well, I know how things feel for me, and therefore I'm basing my choice of what movement I want to engage in today on how I'm feeling today.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: Yeah. And it's just yeah. I would say, that's that's where you know where you feel like an intuitive eater. When you get to a place where you can make that decision without any second guessing guilt, shame whatever where you make the decision. Well, today I feel like pizza.

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unknown: or today, I feel like fruit salad, or today I feel like you know, that sort of thing, or at this moment in time. This is what I what feels good, and I think with with movement. Ideally, you'd be in a place where you want to do that as well, wouldn't you? Where you feel like today, I want to do kickboxing because I'm angry, and I need to punch somebody.

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unknown: Yeah, yes, but also I mean, a little bit of routine is not bad either. So that's my.

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unknown: Definitely.

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unknown: That's what I would say, but only, you know, after a certain period of time. But this is obviously how long is a piece of string, and not everybody needs that full brick movement. I definitely needed it.

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unknown: But doesn't. Can I just ask you with the routine? Because when I start working with people, we often put a bit of a routine in place, and they're like Whoa isn't intuitive eating to eat when and as and when I feel like it, I'm like, no, because initially, it helps you to establish that regularity.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: So would you say it's the same for movement, or would you say the routine comes at the end because I feel like routine for me personally would be really helpful when it comes to.

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unknown: I mean, it's very different for the food angle, because you literally need food to live, don't you? And most people are moving a little bit, anyway, in their daily

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unknown: life. Yeah. And it just depends on the person sometimes a step back from all of those activities that have just been feeling arduous and and difficult, is really helpful.

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unknown: Hmm.

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unknown: And just sort of thinking, and it might. You might not need long at all for some people. They don't need to step back. They can just think right. I'm going to take it down a notch. I'm going to start doing a gentle Yoga class, or I'm going to do something different. And you can. You can kind of work in tandem with things, but it's just finding space to somehow see. Do I enjoy this.

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unknown: Is this working for me? How do I feel when I don't do this? It's

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unknown: And being comfortable with the discomfort, sitting in the discomfort of not working out every single day in a certain way.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: I got to a point. If I missed my run I couldn't cope with life.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: You know, and I think that's when you've got to go. Hold on a second.

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unknown: Yeah, it is a coping mechanism. It's great for mental health. But if it is the only and the prime one.

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unknown: yeah.

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unknown: Then it becomes not quite such a healthy pursuit.

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unknown: Yeah. Oh, yeah, I totally agree with you. And I think that kind of brings us full circle back to the sort of all or nothing that we were talking about right at the beginning. Because if you if you learn to sit with that discomfort, you are basically in that murky area where it's not yes or no, black or white, one thing or the other, because you are allowing

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unknown: you're allowing that discomfort to kind of be there and not not push you one way or the other.

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unknown: because it's just there, and you are building tolerance to it. And I think that is so so important to allow ourselves to feel uncomfortable.

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unknown: I know I have this lovely client who comes to my Kettlebell class, and she took time off.

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unknown: and you know I think it was a whole term she took off.

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unknown: and it was exactly what she needed. It was. She was just so tired, and she was really struggling with it, and it wasn't serving her.

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unknown: Hmm.

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unknown: Be pushing her body at that point.

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unknown: and I was in awe of her. I just thought, Wow, this is brilliant. She knows her body. She's very much I am giving myself permission to take this time off and not push it. And then she came back, and is really enjoying it. So for her.

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unknown: She just needed to step back, and I think that's something we maybe don't do enough. I don't want to say you should. We don't need another should. But it is something that I definitely I could do more of.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: And I think you know, it's we're so tending towards hustle culture. And I think we need to step back towards.

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unknown: Hmm.

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unknown: Relaxing, culture.

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unknown: Also permission to rest. Isn't.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: In a different way.

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unknown: Yeah.

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unknown: It's sort of just sitting, but resting from all of the stuff that we're doing all the time.

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unknown: I know, but it's all I would say. Ella is for anybody out there. Listening is lower the bar and be a bit more compassionate. Think, be a bit more curious rather than judgmental of yourself, of your body. How you feel! What would you? What would you? What are your parting words.

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unknown: Now parting words. I haven't prepared anything. Yeah, no, I think you're. I think you're spot on. There. Be compassionate and

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unknown: and and show up which you said earlier, I think showing up is important. Use that motivation of having shown up and work within your bandwidth

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unknown: and understand that it doesn't have to be one thing or the other. There's loads of different things that can be playing

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unknown: a role in your decision or your choices at any one time, and you know, if something is hard, it doesn't have to be punishing. It can still be enjoyable.

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unknown: And don't listen to Matthew Mcconaughey.

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unknown: No.

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unknown: Oh!

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unknown: Good.

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unknown: Yeah, I know. I know you can. If you want. It's your

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unknown: you have autonomy. Do what you want to do.

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unknown: I don't understand what he says most of the time, because his drawl is so strong.

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unknown: I love his toys.

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unknown: I do, but I just need subtitles. But then I need subtitles for most things these days.

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unknown: Probably for me. You understand me, which is quite.

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unknown: I understand you very well. Yes, now I think it's a lot of sort of mumbly kind of accents that I'm like. No idea, love no idea what you just said, mostly TV programs, because everyone just sort of mumbles these days. So I have everything with subtitles.

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unknown: Yeah, I do. I do that as well, which I should stop doing just because it's easier, you know.

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unknown: Well, you're reading. You're reading a book.

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unknown: There you go! You're welcome.

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unknown: We've hit a new high. So, anyway, thank you so much for joining us this week. We're not here, and I just want to sort of say this, we're not here to sit on a pedestal and tell you how to eat and move. That's the opposite of what we're trying to do. We're trying to start a different conversation and try to move the conversation away from weight, loss and aesthetics, and actually to how we feel in our body, so I think.

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unknown: and we don't have all the answers. But it's good to talk.

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unknown: Might sound like we do, but we really don't. And I think we made it quite clear that we're working through our own stuff and trying to figure things out. And I think that's important to recognize that this is not a fix it all. It's like a process that you can use to

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unknown: to work things out for yourself. Really.

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unknown: Yeah, I'm just getting a bit more curious rather than judging yourself so harshly, and lots of love to you all, and we will see you next week. We've got a cracking guest for you.

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unknown: I'm so excited.

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unknown: Bye.

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unknown: Bye.